Chinua Achebe
Recently, the classic African novel “Things Fall Apart” by Nigerian
author Chinua Achebe was translated into Persian by Ali Hodavand and
released in Iran. Nasrin Pourhamrang, Editor-in-Chief of Hatef Weekly
Magazine interviewed the author on a wide range of topics from Art,
culture and literature;politics, cultural and linguistic preservation;to
the legacy of colonialism and his forthcoming book there was a
Country-A personal history of Biafra.
Chinua Achebe was born in Nigeria in 1930. He was raised in the large
village of Ogidi, one of the first centers of Anglican missionary work
in Eastern Nigeria, and is a graduate of University College, Ibadan. His
early career in radio ended abruptly in 1966, when he left his post as
Director of External Broadcasting in Nigeria during the national
upheaval that led to the Biafran War. Achebe joined the Biafran Ministry
of Information and represented Biafra on various diplomatic and
fund-raising missions. He was appointed Senior Research Fellow at the
University of Nigeria, Nsukka, and began lecturing widely abroad. For
over fifteen years, he was the Charles P. Stevenson Professor of
Languages and Literature at Bard College. He is now the David and
Marianna Fisher University Professor and professor of Africana studies
at Brown University.
Chinua Achebe has written over twenty books – novels, short stories,
essays children’s books and collections of poetry. His latest work There
was a country – A personal history of Biafra will be available from
Penguin publishers in September. Achebe has received numerous honors
from around the world, including the Honorary Fellowship of the American
Academy of Arts and Letters, as well as honorary doctorates from more
than forty colleges and universities. He is also the recipient of
Nigeria’s highest award for intellectual achievement, the Nigerian
National Merit Award; the Peace Prize of the German Book trade
(Friedenspreis des Deutschen Buchhandels) in 2002; the Man Booker
International Prize for Fiction in 2007; and the Gish Prize in 2010.
Nasrin Pourhamrang: Technology has come to the help of the
borderless world of art and literature and has eliminated the
geographical frontiers. How do you feel about the fact that your novel
has been translated into Persian and that Iranian readers can read some
of your works for the first time and make an acquaintance of Chinua
Achebe?
Chinua Achebe: I received the news of the Persian translation of
Things Fall Partwith great joy!Of course, one of the goals of any writer
is to connect with his or her readers. Things Fall Apart in particular,
indeed all my books, have enjoyed a warm readership. I am particularly
grateful for the effort of the translators of my work. They extend the
reach of Art, in this case stories, to more people who may not have
encountered them in the original English. I am told with this Persian
translation that Things Fall Apart now exists in nearly 60 world
languages! It is a wonderful blessing and I am deeply, deeply,
grateful!So, the fact that readers in Iran can also read my work is very
important to me.
NP: Are you familiar with Iran, its culture and civilization?
Have you ever heard of the artworks of Iranian artists as well as the
work of her authors and writers?
CA: I am a life-long student of Literature, History, Art and Culture.
I can’t, however, claim to be an authority on Iranian history and
culture. Let me also confess that I was caught looking through my
Encyclopedia Britannica before this interview – my grandchildren insist
that no one does that anymore!
Nevertheless, I am aware of the writings of Herodotus on the Persian
Empire and the spectacular golden art work of the Achaemenid period. I
have always wanted to seethe ruins of Thachar palace and Persepolis;the
Quajarid reliefs, paintings from Iranian antiquity and the beauty of
Persian calligraphyup-close. Of course, Persian carpets, as you are well
aware, are adored the world over.In university, we encountered stories
about great Persian emperors like Cyrus the Great who Alexander the
Great revered. Also Darius the Great…and the later emperors.
As a writer, as you might expect, I have a special interest in the
ancient scrolls of Persian philosophy. I have also been taken with the
medieval poetry ofRumi, Hafez, Sa’adi, Khayyam, Farrid Attar; as well
asepics such Shahnameh (The Book of Kings) by Ferdowsi. Modern Iranian
classics such as The Blind OwlbyHedayat and Sin by Farrokhzad should be
required reading around the world, in my opinion. On mydesk is Cypress
Tree by Kamin Mohammadi, who I understand, is a very talented young
female writer.
NP: What will you say if I ask you to talk directly to the Iranian audience and discuss your concerns and wishes with them?
CA: “Peaceful co-existence between all racial and religious groups is my sincere wish for mankind”
After the ancient civilizations of Africa, there are no peoples older
than those that inhabit what the British first called “the Middle East.”
The great world religions come from this part of the world. Islam and
Judaism are considered Abrahamic religions because they are believed to
descend from God through Abraham. We would not have Christianity without
Judaism and the Jewish people. The three religions share many values
and tenets and beliefs. There are parts of the Quran that integrate
Jewish history.
I wish to highlight lessons from Iranian history that should be
championed by Iranian people in today’s precarious world. It is
important for all of us to remember that the Iranians and the Jewish
people have enjoyed a very long, mutually beneficial and fruitful
relationship. It dates back to 727 B.C. and the deportation of the
Jewish people to Media and Persian from Samaria…that is nearly three
thousand years ago! Cyrus the Great, who we have mentioned in this
conversation, through a decree later known as the “Cyrus declaration”
allowed the Jewish people who lived along the Babylon river to return to
Judea to rebuild their lives. Many, however, who had lived in Persia
for a few generations, decided to remain and formed permanent Jewish
settlements of intellectuals, merchants and artisans for centuries.
Jewish scholars (something I am told can be confirmed in the Talmud –
a revered Jewish book of rabbinical postulates), teach us that the
environment was so tolerant for Jews in ancient Persia during this
period that in a mark of their own magnanimity towards the Persian
people, there was a call by Rabbis of the time for a picture of Susa the
capital of Persian Kings to be engraved on the eastern gate of the
temple of Jerusalem!
My appeal, therefore, is to the ancient virtue of Iranian hospitality,
tolerance and peace. It is vitally important that the educated classes
in Iran point out this glorious history which is central not just to the
Middle East; but to all of mankind.
Finally, I would like to see the Dialogue of Civilizations proposed
by former Iranian President Mohammad Khatami become reality–bringing
together representatives of all of the earth’s people to Tehran in an
environment of freedom of creative, intellectual,cultural and religious
expression.
NP: Your new work There was a Country-A personal history of
Biafra is due from Penguin Books next month- September, 2012 – in the
United Kingdom. Can you tell Iranian readers what it is about?
CA: The Nigerian-Biafran war raged from 1967-1970 and claimed nearly
three million lives. The conflict wiped out twenty percent of my people –
the Igbo and other Easterners- who were known as Biafrans. In There was
a Country- A personal history of Biafra, I tell three interweaving
stories – using an autobiographical prism torecount twobroader stories –
the story of pre and post-independence Nigeria, and the story of Biafra
and its aftermath.
I have been asked why it took me over 42 years to write about
Biafra…The answer is that I was not ready… I had to find the right
vehicle that could “carry our anguish, our sorrow… the scale of
dislocation and destruction…our collective pain.”In many ways, I can say
that I have been writing this book for about four decades – at least in
my head and the very scribbling on paper almost as long – particularly
the research, interviews, data collection etc. I discoveredwhile working
on the book, quite interestingly, that it would not be a straight
forward work. I found that I had to draw upon prose, poetry, history,
memoir, and politics and that they were independently holding
conversations with each other – perhaps because no one genre or art form
could bear the weight of the complexity of our condition.You see, the
Biafran war was such a cataclysmic event that in my opinion changed the
course, not only of Nigeria, which has not fully recovered from that
conflict; but of all of Africa. I hope your readers pick up a copy!
Nigerian
novelist Chinua Achebe chats with former South African President Nelson
Mandela at a Steve Biko memorial ceremony in Cape Town in 2002. Biko, a
leader of the Black Consciousness movement, died after being beaten by
members of Apartheid’s police force. Photo/AFP
NP: It is interesting to me that your first novel, “Things
Fall Apart,” which is also your most widely read and translated book was
published by a British publisher (William Heinemann LTD). Why did you
offer it to a British publisher while it depicted the difficulties and
cultural contradictions which the people of your country have suffered
as a result of the colonial presence of the British in the past decades?
CA: That is a timely question…… In my new book,There was a Country-A
personal history of Biafra, I point out that when a number of us [i.e.
African writers] decided to pick up the pen and make writing a career
there was no African literature as we know it today. There were many
that preceded my time, but still, the numbers were not sufficient.And so
I had no idea when I was writing Things Fall Apart whether it would
even be accepted or published. All this was new- there was nothing by
which I could gauge how it was going to be received.
In those days one had very few avenues to get published…we had very
few choices. My first novel was rejected by a number of publishers
before providence led it into the hands of Alan Hill at Heinemann after
Donald McRae, another Heinemann executive with extensive experience in
Africa encouraged Heinemann to publish the novel with a powerful
recommendation: “This is the best first novel I have read since the
war.”
So, you can tell that I had a good beginning and was only too pleased
to have Heinemann publish the work. Later, Alan Hill and James Currey
and I developed the African Writers Series (I served as first General
Editor for the first one hundred titles). The African Writers Series
ended up publishing many of the well-known writers of the era from
Africa. In many ways, without the intervention of Alan Hill and
Heinemann, many of the writers from that generation may not have found a
voice.
NP: Over 50 years have passed since you wrote the book
“Things Fall Apart.” Have your viewpoints and approaches toward the
presence of a colonial power in the soil of your country changed since
that time? Would you make changes and edits if you were to decide to
write such a novel or rewrite it now and especially reconfigure the
personality and reflections of the main characters such as Okonkwo?
CA: Every thinking person, if you consider yourself a serious
intellectual grows…Intellectual evolution and growth does not mean,
however, that all of a sudden horrendous things in our shared history
appear less appalling. It means that greater knowledge and understanding
help place the best and worst of events in clearer perspective.
The legacy of colonialism is not a simple one but one of great
complexity, with contradictions- good things as well as bad. We do not
have enough time to outline every aspect of the colonial and
post-colonial condition…So, one cannot talk about making changes or
edits to a book that was written to speak to a condition that existed
and continues to exist in different forms and different guises.
In many ways, the world is a much different place today than it was
in 1958 when Things Fall Apart was published.Some may say a better place
– women’s rights are improving around the world, race relations perhaps
can be said to have improved as well. In other ways, many things can
also be said to have either remained the same or become worse. So the
struggle to make the world a better place must continue!
(
L-R)
John Pepper Clark-Bekederemo; Chinua Achebe (center) and Wole Soyinka –
after meeting with former Nigerian Dictator Ibrahim Babangida (IBB) to
plead for the lives of the poet General Mamman Jiya Vatsa and sixteen
other officers for staging what has since come to be known as a phantom
coup March, 1986
NP: Your books and novels are considered to be the
representative of modern African literature. In your view, what are the
most prominent features and attributes of the modern African literature?
CA: Yes, well…remember that there was an entire movement, a whole
group of us…InThere was a country,I discuss this in greater depth.
Things Fall Apart, I believe, now has a life of its own. I think it
is now more famous than I am! (Laughter). The fifty plus translations
are a big indication of its impact. I feel like a parent watching a
child succeed from the sidelines. The other books have also been
successful. It feels good. I am very grateful. What was the second part
of the question?
NP: What are the most prominent features and attributes of the modern African literature?
CA: Yes…I have stated elsewhere that one cannot cram African
literature into a small, neat definition. I do not see African
literature as one unit but as a group of associated units – in fact the
sum total of all the national and ethnic literatures of Africa.
National literature in my definition is written in national languages
and has a potential audience throughoutthe countries that speak that
language. Ethnic literature, by contrast is available to a particular
ethnic group within that country or sub-region.
I have often been asked why I choose to write in English rather than
in my native language.That is a flawed question and a false choice,
because most of us think and write in and speak both our ethnic language
and the national languages we were taught in school. Context is very
important…Those that ask this question fail to understand my goal and
the goal of several other pioneers of modern African writing. When I
picked up the pen to make writing a career, African literature did not
exist as it does today…the numbers were not there. One of the
consequences of colonialism was the loss of the many traditions of
Africa.
Many of us engaged Africa’s past, stepping back into what can be
referred to as the “era of purity” before the coming of Europe. What we
discovered we put in books and that became known widely as “African
Culture.” Some of us would decide to use the colonizer’s tools: his
language, altered sufficiently to bear the weight of an African creative
aesthetic, infused with elements of the African literary tradition. I
borrowed proverbs from our culture and history, colloquialisms and
African expressive language from the ancient griots, the world views,
perspectives, and customs from my Igbo tradition and cosmology, and the
sensibilities of everyday people.
It was important to us that a body of work be developed of the
highest possible quality that would oppose the negative discourse in
some of the novels we encountered. By “writing back” to the West we were
attempting to reshape the dialogue between the colonized and the
colonizer. Our efforts, we hoped, would broaden the world’s
understanding, appreciation, and conceptualization of what literature
meant when including the African voice and perspective. We were engaged
in what the Nigerian literary scholar Ode Ogede terms “the politics of
representation.”
Chinua Achebe, about 1960. Eliot Elisofon—Time Life Pictures/Getty Images
NP: So your choice of writing in English was as much a political choice as a practical one?
CA: Yes. And this requires some further clarification…My books appear
in English because it is Nigeria’s national language and the language
through which I can reach the most readers, both in Nigeria and
world-wide. Many of the national languages, as you are aware, are
inherited languages from our colonial history that were “shoved down our
throats.”Within Nigeria’s borders, there are two hundred and fifty
(250) ethnic groups and distinct languages – note I said distinct
languages not dialects – and this requires emphasis because Nigeria with
160 million people, exists in an area of Africa that is one of the most
populous, as well as genetically, linguistically, and culturally
diverse regions of our planet. A national language in such an
environment despite its problems, serves both a practical as well as a
logical way to communicate across this diversity, effectively.
Let’s be clear – there are areas of Africa where colonialism divided
peoples…But on the whole it did bring together many peoples…And it gave
them a language with which to talk to one another…The only reason why we
can even talk about African unity is that when we get together we can
have a manageable number of languages to communicate in.Indeed we would
not be able to hold this conversation if we both did not speak English.
We would not be talking about the influence of Things Fall Apart and its
impact without this strategic choice.
So there were many practical reasons to write in a National Language:
I have already mentioned the fact that I could reach many Africans
across languages, but also I could reach others across the world as
well, like you. But I have also stated multiple times that it is neither
necessary nor desirable for an African writer writing in English to
attempt to write like a native speaker…he or she must attempt to find a
way as I mentioned earlier to alter the language sufficiently to bear
the weight of an African creative aesthetic, infused with elements of
the African literary tradition…reinventing the language of the
colonizers to tell our stories and retell our collective histories.
NP: There is, however, the problem of the disappearance of native or indigenous cultures and languages…
CA: Yes, the“beating down” of older African cultures and languages,
traditions, and philosophies must be halted. We must continue to
recapture, revive these endangered cultures, languages and traditions…
and this will require large scale intervention…This is a real emergency,
and in my opinion requires bold action.
There are two levels to this solution. Economists often talk about
the micro and macro levels.On the individual level…I have already spoken
about African writers engaged in the retelling of their own stories and
recasting their image and the image of their people through novels,
children’s books, poetry etc. There are those that write solely in their
native languages. I write a lot of poetry in Igbo and edited a literary
journal Uwa NdiIgbo for several years – for a focused Igbo readership. I
have given full scale lectures to upwards of 20,000 people at a time –
the two most recent The Odenigbo lecture and the Ahajioku lectures in
1999 and 2009 respectively; in Igbo land in Nigeria.Thatkind of effort
isimportant, but I am afraid itonly scratches the surface of the
problem… the sheer scale of the crisis demands big solutions, large
scale intervention.
Let me let you in on a well-guarded secret…For several decades, the
Achebe foundation –an organizationthat is now run by my son Dr. Ike
Achebe and on whose board I serve as Chairman-has been working quietly
on the Igbo Language project. This initiative was developed to create a
language dictionary, a vast array of language tools and educational and
linguistic guides, as well asa data base of phonetics, syntax, grammar
etc.- to preserve Igbo, a fast disappearing language.
NP: What you describe is quite remarkable but sounds so incredibly daunting…
CA: Yes, in many ways it is…but one must not let despair crush our
resolve!There is another layer of complexity that I would like to point
out that makes this work so vitally important: Literacy in African
traditional languages – the number of people who can read and write in a
given language – is very low. This is not unique to Africa, indeed it
also true in all places around the world where we find theproblem of
linguistic extinction. The building blocks of literary and linguistic
fluency (equally important) – the alphabet, phonetics, penmanship,
diction, syntax, grammar etc. must be also captured and widely taught.
It is also important to state that language does not exist in a cultural
vacuum…in cultural isolation. The ‘Omenani’ of a people – their belief
system, customs, cosmology, values, and worldview – are channeled
through a people’s language. Now, these are aspects of a people’s
culture (and there are other vital components)that should be captured as
well, if one is to attain the goal of preserving a people’s language
effectively.
NP: How do you avoid the perception that you are imposing your will on
others- something that your work has so eloquently highlighted?
CA: That is an excellent question…The Achebe foundation’sIgbo project
does not and will not practice cultural imperialism.Wedo not impose
artificial structures on the languages (a subject of my Odenigbo lecture
of 1999), but willstrive to preserve what is on the ground and respect
linguistic dynamism. That means having the people themselves lead the
way and having members of our team approach the work with humility…not
with the “I am here to save the world” mentality, but with a “how can
we, together, accomplish this incredibly important task!” spirit.Another
way to protect indigenous cultures is to make sure you have present
local representation and a diversity of workers and perspectives on the
project.
A small army of experts and partners from around the globe –
linguists, computer scientists, statisticians, literature professors,
linguistic historians, educators, etc. – have been working on this for
several decades. It is all very exciting, but it also means that no one
group can exert an undue influence or pressure on the work. There is
also a major push to capture what has been termed “linguistic
idiosyncrasies” – speech patterns and accents that may have been lost to
history. For instance, in the dictionary there is a list of several
versions of a single word (in various dialects) rather than one
standardized version.
We intend very soon to present our work to the local schools and
provide teachers, students, parents, communities, women’s groups and
others with tools to preserve, engage with, and propagate Igbo language
and culture.
NP: Your work with the Igbo Language projectis incredibly
important. Do you intend to spread your effort to other parts of Africa,
other endangered languages of the world?
CA: Yes and I hope that the funding will be available.There are many
other languages that UNESCO and others have placed on the endangered
list. We would like to provide a helping hand in confronting the
problems facing several other African languages in much the same way we
have tackled the Igbo Language project, to protect them from extinction…
but we cannot do it alone. This project has been very expensive and has
required personal expenditure on my part…and I do not consider myself a
wealthy person. Thankfully, it has also been supported by several
foundations and universities in America, but more funding is needed.
International NGOs [Non-Governmental Organizations] and African
governments should tackle this alarming problem as well. African
governments have a lot of work do -there are stumbling blocks to reading
that we have discovered – poor eyesight for example. There is a great
need for reading glasses in the millions – it is quite alarming.
You can see from what I have described and how long it is taking in
just one instance that language and cultural preservation is a
painstakingly difficult process that requires an army of dedicated
workers and a great deal of resources and effort.This is not a simple
problem but one of great complexity. And we need well-funded,large-scale
projects to tackle this problem before it is too late.
NP: You’ve experienced living in what you have termed the
“poorer addresses of the planet” – in African nations – as well as
indeveloped Western countries. What’s your evaluation of the
relationship between wealth, technology and culture?
CA: In my opinion, good art can come from any culture and background.
Great Art does not cluster in one part of the world or the other. We
are living in interesting times. Globalization is our reality, for good
or ill… and I can talk about the problems for hours!There are also good
things – technology: the internet, television, emails; other tools– have
made our world smaller. Many of the best artists and writers are global
citizens – they move constantly.Today, there exists a significant
degree of cross-fertilization of cultures, ideas, values, stories, art,
music, languages – you name it, on a grand scale across the globe. Many
artists might have come from former less developed colonies but now they
operate on the world stage. So the times have changed.
Having said that, I still feel that before we can announce the
arrival of the Great World Story, or Universal culture, we should hear
all the stories… appreciate all that the world has to offer. We should
hear more stories and revel in the Art from indigenous societies of
Africa, Australia, from the Middle East, from Eastern Europe, from
Native Americans, from China,India, Brazil and under-represented
cultures of Latin America-countries like Ecuador, Uruguay-the Caribbean,
and Oceania etc.
Artists from the developing world do no one a favor by blindly
copying Western styles and forms. And let me be clear, because I am
often misunderstood: I am not decreeing how a writer should write. I am
not suggesting that artists should not or cannot be influenced by other
artists from different parts of the world.
That is welcome. I am suggesting that an artist should be true to who
and what they are and should aspire to produce the best art that they
can …that is when the magic in art is released. What I am calling for is
an environment where freedom of creative expression is not only
possible but protected… where an artist from any part of the
worldcanacquire and develop their unique voice and then express
themselves on the Great Cultural Stagein full ear shot of the world!
NP: You are now based at Brown University – an American Ivy
League University, where you hold the David and Marianna Fisher
University Professorship and spearhead the Achebe Colloquium. Tell me a
bit more about this initiative.
CA: Yes… well the eminent Ruth Simmons, the former President of Brown
recruited me to Brown in 2009,to start a new project in keeping with my
life’s work. The Achebe Colloquium on Africa as it is called annually
brings together an international group of scholars – Africanists,
officials from African governments, the United Nations, the United
States, the European Union, and other organizations – for two days of
intense deliberation and exchange of ideas on the importance of
strengthening democracy and peace on the African continent. We have had
three gatherings since its inception and discussed topics like
Corruption, the leadership crisis in Africa, the Rwanda Genocide, the
Crisis in the Congo, Nigeria’s myriad problems, the Arab Spring etc.
This year’s conference will focus on Governance, Peace and Security in
Africa.
Q: Let me end on a lighter note. Why have you attempted to
write books for the children while you’ve been mostly focused on writing
serious novels for the adults? How is it possible for you to shift your
concentration from the complex and problematical world of adults to the
simple and happy world ofchildren? Which type of writing is more
enjoyable to you?
CA: I decided to write for children as a matter of urgency and
necessity. I first noticed there was a problem when I had my first child
Chinelo and went to the bookshopsto buy books for her. This was soon
after independence from Great Britain. The books about Africa for
children were, to put it mildly, not appropriate. So I decided that if I
did not like the content of the children’s books, I would write my own.
Now, around the same time, my friend Christopher Okigbo – Africa’s
greatest modern poet – was the Cambridge University Press’
representative for the entire West African region. He also wanted to
create a body of work that was based on local thought and African values
for our children. Okigbo was a phenomenal publisher. He was so busy
with the world and life and yet he got Cyprian Ekwensi to write a
Passport of Mallam Ilia. He then came to me and said “Chinua you must
write a children’s book.”
So, in many ways, Chike and the River was a mandated work by
Christopher Okigbo. Okigbo had a way of “getting you to do something
that you want to do.” He had a saying that the books he published must
be first rate or he wouldn’t bother at all. He outlined the Cambridge
University Press ‘culture’ – their expectations for a certain number of
pages, for a particular moral code, for a particular standard of writing
etc. When I accepted to write the book, I already had an inspiration in
my life from which to draw for this particular story. I shared in
Okigbo’s desire to mold young children into good citizens through good
story telling. It sounds heavy, but infact, good writing has a heaviness
of its own – like the moral purpose that pervades Shakespeare or the
work of Charles Dickens.
So when I took my manuscript in 1966 to Okigbo, he sent it
immediately to the Cambridge publishers and they said they liked it but
it was too short, to which Okigbo said in good humour to me: “go and
read Ekwensi’s children’s book to get a sense of what we want.” So I
went back to work and increased the length of the book. It wasn’t
something I was planning to get done immediately, but Okigbo gave it an
urgency. We were both concerned that African literature for children as
it was formulated up to that point, had numerous stories in our oral
tradition, but nothing in published form, so I too understood that there
was work ahead of us to do, and quickly!I later published other books
for children How the Leopard got its Claws, the Flute; and the Drum.
I think writing is very serious work and very important. All writing
for me is a privilege and a joy. I do not have a favorite genre and I
have written novels (prose), poetry, children’s books, essays,
non-fiction works and political commentaries.
I will leave you with a passage from my new book There was a
country-A personal history of Biafra, that I feel encapsulates my
sentiments about writing:
The triumph of the written word is often attained when the writer
achieves union and trust with the reader who then becomes ready to be
drawn deep into familiar and occasionally unfamiliar territory, walking
in borrowed literary shoes so to speak, towards a deeper understanding
of self, society, or of foreign peoples, cultures and situations.
Nasrin Pourhamrang is an Iranian journalist and the chief editor
of Hatef weekly magazine, a local publication based in the northern
Iranian province of Guilan.
